safety concerns

[draggin81]

Everyone knows (I hope) that the chemicals in clear coats, especially the isocyanates, are some really nasty stuff. Obviously, you don't want in on your skin, in your eyes, and especially in your lungs.
That said, what is the best way for a "hobbyist" to spray clear? And how much protection in really neccessary when using small quantities for short durations?
I looked on the OSHA website, and according to them, the ONLY safe way to spray anything containing isocyanates is with a full body suit, full face mask, and a posititve pressure breathing system.
Now, for someone who is exposed to these chemicals all day every day, that seems like just plain common sense. But what about someone who sprays clear on pretty rare occasions, and on objects no larger than, say, motorcycle tins. Would taking the "no sh!t sherlock" precautions of covering up your skin, wearing protectice eye wear, and using a respirator be safe enough? Or would you be putting your health at risk? (oh yeah, assuming you're spraying in a well ventiated area or better yet, outside)
Also, would your normal 3M respirator (negative pressure)like they have at hardware stores be sufficient protection, or would you want special filters for it? Or is a positive pressure mask really the only way to keep this stuff out of your system, even at low exposure levels?

[draggin81]

Oh yeah, one more question. Would using a low VOC clear, like HOK's UFC19 for instance, have any effect on safety? Or are the isocyanates and VOC's completely different problems?
Do the lower-VOC clears perform and hold up as well as the "regular" clears?

[Cowboy]

Hey Draggin , Ya perty much answered Yerself. You Know the dangers so its Yer choice on whats more important. Ive been over this 100 times at the other place, & am talking from personal experience.

If Ya dont mind going blind at an early age , having cataraches, & other lesions afecting Yer eyesight & constantly feeling like sumpthings in Yer eye. & constant burning . Then dont worry about eye protection .

If Ya dont mind Yer skin turning ta leather & Red irritating patches all over with areas that never heal completely . & Yer ears turnin Red & constantly irritated , Then dont wear a headsock, long sleeve shirts & pants & Possibly a paper disposable paint suits .

As far as The respirator You can probably get by with a dust mask if Ya want, Depending on Which internal organs Ya chose to protect . The better the mask , Well you get the picture. If Ya have any facial hair . Either shave it off or get a hood with fresh air supply . Because the face masks cannot properly seal otherwise .

As far as Yer last question on low vocs. I cant answer Cuz I aint no chemist. But I dont see what real difference it makes . Its kinda like saying , how much cyanide with Yer coffee One lump or two. Any amount Is gonna shorten Yer life & at the very least alter the Quality of it.

Keep in mind this poison gets in Yer system , eyes , nose , ears, & skin it is absorbed any place it can get in & It NEVER EVER !! leaves Yer system .

Some people dont think They need protection when their mixing the clear & wear no or little protection. WRONG. thats when the chemicals are the worst & start there gassing process & Yer standing right over it exposed.

Yes proper ventilation will allways help, But what most people use Yer just moving it around & probably just dumpin it on someone else & exposing them to it without there knowledge.

Now I know this is kind of a smart ass response . Sorry But I am the poster child for stupid when it comes to wearing proper protection . I started out with laqs, never wore a mask , & When times changed & so did the chemicals. I just never really thought much of it . But at least hada good spray booth to help some. Hell I used ta spray that crap in sandles jean shorts & a tank top. Now thats what Ya call an inteligence test & I obviously flunked .

I am just now getting back to playin with the stuff again, But I,m so sensitive to it Now I have to be really carefull. Bottom line Better safe than sorry. Dont be lazy when Yer mixin the stuff Or think I,m just gonna do a few squirts here, I,ll just hold My breath. It,s kinda like being a lil bit pregnant. But Yer talkin about poison. Its Yer life. Paint safe. Sorry for the novel .

I Forgot to add ,Just cuz Yer done spraying the clear, Doesn,t mean the danger or risk is gone. Thats when Yer ventilation is really important, Because it will continue to gas off for awhile. If You can smell it. Its still there. Best to cure outside out of the sun if possible.

[Whit]

Ol school here as well,,, same senario as CB ,,,
my first contact with 2 part paint was Imron,,,
"what,, me worry",,, sprayed with no mask,,
2 am,, woke up with NO AIR,,, I was breathing,,
but I was'nt getting any air,,, took awhile to
get over it,, but today,, I WEAR A MASK !!!
If you can smell it,, put on a mask,,, vaseline
the inside of it to seal it tight around the edges,,
This is chemical dry,, it gets inside you,, it clear
coats the inside of your lungs,, smooth n shiney
and no air gets thru,, old stuff,, you just hacked
awhile and got over it,, this stuff today will kill ya !!!
I guess this 2 cents,, with cowbows 3 cents,,,
Best Nickle Your Gonna Get !!!

[redanner]

Ol school here also. 15 years of before I give up spraying with production guns. Wore a respirator when I used paints that were used with the chemical hardners. I used just a paper mask when using laquer. 53 now, as far as I know nothing wrong with me. Last time I had my lungs x-rayed I had clear lungs. This not to say that I was right in doing so. Everybody reacts differently to things like smoking & drinking. I had no way of knowing if I would not screw myself up. Use what you can tolerate and still do your work. Always have an exhaust fan to clear the air.

[draggin81]

Just thought I'd add an update here....
After some research and waaaay too much reading I've found some somewhat concrete answers on wotking safely with iso's.
First, a respirator equipped with filters rated for organic vapors, along with those P95 pre-filters WILL protect you from isocyanates. The reason that OSHA and NIOSH have the positive air pressure only policy is that there isn't any way to know when the filter is no good anymore. The problem is that the isocyanates themselves aren't easily detected (no taste or smell), so you wouldn't know if the filters you're using have stopped working.
On the flip side, most of the other substances in the paint and vapors will penetrate the filters before the isocyanates will, so in reality, you'll know when the filters have had it when you start smelling anything (other than your own bad breath, or even worse, the belch you just let out from your pastrami lunch)
Isocyanates will penetrate clothing, so wearing a Tyvek (or anything similar) suit is recommended. Also, wear non-permiable gloves (latex-type) to keep skin contact to an absolute minimum. Also, wear some sort of eye protection. The iso's will be absorbed through your tear ducts, not to mention can do actual damage to the eyes in high enough exposures.
The biggest risk of iso poisoning occurs when you're spraying, since you're atomizing it and effectively making a nice big iso-cloud. There is still significant risk while mixing you clear with the reducers or activators.
Basically, if you can smell the clear coat, you are at risk of absorbing isocyanates, even when the piece is "flashing off".
I'm hoping that everyone is smart enough to know when and where to spray this stuff, but just in case.....
Use in a VERY well ventilated area. If you can spray outside without putting your unsuspecting neighbors at risk thats a good way to go. Setting up a fan or two is a good idea if there isn't much of a breeze.
Spraying clears inside IS NOT an option unless you have a proper spray booth. And no, a fan in your window doesn't count. I mean a spray ROOM, like the professionals use.
Bottom line, if you know what you're dealing with, and use your common sense you should be able to safely work with isocyanates, provided you have the resources.